Why Amazon Should Come To NYC

USA Today reported that NYC is working on a proposal to encourage Amazon to locate its second headquarters “HQ2” in NYC.

I can’t imagine a better place for HQ2 than NYC.

Here are ten reasons why Amazon should stop thinking about any other place and just pick NYC:

  1. NYC is headquarters to many global companies. It has the transportation systems, building stock, and talent base that companies need and desire for their headquarters.
  2. It has 8.5mm people, enough to satisfy Amazon’s insatiable appetite for talent.
  3. It is home to the entrepreneurs, creators, innovators, and big ideas that Amazon is looking to surround itself with.
  4. It is home to the second largest tech sector in the US.
  5. NYC is committed to teaching computer science to all of the 1.1mm students in its school system by 2025 and is already 1/3 of the way there.
  6. NYC/NYS has embarked on massive infrastructure investment to upgrade its transportation hubs like LGA and Penn Station.
  7. There are something like fifteen direct flights from NYC to Seattle every weekday.
  8. NYC has the largest Amazon customer base of any city in the US (I am guessing on this one. But it has to be true).
  9. NYC will welcome Amazon with open arms unlike some of the other cities that Amazon is considering.
  10. NYC has the most diverse workforce in the US.

So if any AVC readers know how to get this post to the team at Amazon that is making this decision, please send it to them. I am certain NYC is the place for them. They will love it here.


Comments (Archived):

  1. JLM

    .Amazon will not come to NYC because it is NYC.Amazon is coming to Austin, Texas because, in part, it is not NYC.The fix is in. Texas is pulling out its checkbook.The fix was put in when Amazon bought Whole Foods. Where do you think Amazon was spending its time?Austin has been courting them for more than a year. Everybody else is playing catch up.I can even pinpoint the bit of dirt they’re buying and who their broker is.More than half of the above is true.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

    1. Rob Underwood

      Austin?! Fuggedaboutit!(Yes this will be the default reply today).And if NYC doesn’t get it I am pulling for Portland, Maine. I won’t miss a chance to push my homestate and its incredible largest city. Among the best food in the country and a thriving tech community.Austin does have great BBQ through? High speed rail to Lockhart maybe?

      1. JLM

        .Preliminary plans include both a Terry Black’s and a Green Mesquite BBQ on the property.The site they have under option, getting its own on ramp on IH35, is located near an airport which is not Bergstrom. The runway is capable of handling small jets and will be extended to handle the big ones.They are haggling with the Texas Opportunity Fund over getting the dirt for free v how many jobs they create in the first 10 years.Deep Eddy Vodka will be setting up a distillation column nearby. No definitive word from Tito’s.There is a residential development nearby with a 7,000 home (including 16 apartment sites) build out. Word on the street is Amazon is going to develop the apartments.Amazon and Austin are beyond going steady. They fell in love when they were doing the Whole Foods deal. Baby announcements imminent.WF HQ will be co-located at HQ2.Again, more than half true.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

        1. JamesHRH

          The weird keep getting weirder.Amazon likely a great fit there, culture-wise.

          1. JLM

            .Do NOT underestimate the Amazon – Whole Foods seduction. A’zon has been coming to ATX for years pursuing WF.There is a bit of chemistry between John Mackey and Jeff Bezos.The fix is in. The Texas Opportunity Fund is rumored to be buying the land.WF HQ is going to be moved to the new HQ2.The. Fix. Is. In.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          2. Matt Zagaja

            I remember many years ago when Bob Kraft was planning to move the New England Patriots to my home state in Hartford, CT. The fix was in. Kraft had expertly wooed legislators, the land development deals were inked among those parties, the incentive packages locked in to put a big football stadium in downtown Hartford. A diving save by Paul Kirk along with some clever contractual terms negotiated by Bob Kraft lead to Gillette being built where it is today in Foxborough, MA. Never count your chickens before they hatch.

          3. JLM

            .”I just bought a new knife for filleting chickens,” said the guy who has actually bitten a head off a chicken.With the state involved, there is a lot of money to be thrown around.We have huge Google, FB, Apple, Samsung presences done in the same manner. We are “HQ2” heavy already.The. Fix. Is. In.JLMwww.themusingsofhebigredcar…

          4. LE

            JLM is just spreading FUD to ward off competition. Very possible the same thing was happening with what you are referring to in Hartford CT. After all the way people know the fix is in is by info that is leaked to serve a particular purpose. It can also work in reverse as well. Use it to rev up and get better terms from the place that you really want to be going to.Amazon is just doing this publicly to get as much as they can from the pre-selected list of places they have already decided they want to be. And sure there could be a few dark horses that they didn’t think about that will give them a strong reason to consider. Anything is possible but not highly likely for a major decision like this.Lastly my guess is that very few people at Amazon even those that are involved in this even know what will really happen. It’s not like Bezos is going to not play his own people as part of the process. It’s hard to negotiate if you don’t believe in what you are doing.

          5. Girish Mehta

            Re “JLM is just spreading FUD…”See my comment to JLM. He is having some fun. “More than half”, it seems.Re “…very few people at Amazon even those that are involved in this even know what will really happen”.You are right, this is the dynamic in large global orgs on decisions such as this.

          6. JLM

            .One thing to reflect on — when the WF deal got down to the lick log, the deal was cut by Mackey and Bezos one-on-one. Bezos is a killer.Take a look at the Amazon Board and the Exec team. Look at their ages.http://quotes.wsj.com/AMZN/…Bezos just turned 52. He is the stud duck.He is the shot caller.He called the shot on WF. He likes ATX. He will be picking ATX.The. Fix. Is. In.Remember one other thing — ATX is the only liberal island in an otherwise quite conservative state. Bezos is a lefty. He likes it here.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          7. PhilipSugar

            That is called using a “stalking horse” Hartford never had a chance. I lived in Farmington.Now Oakland found the other end of that stick with Las Vegas. That is going to be a goldmine. I told the President I wanted to head ticket sales……he just laughed. We both agreed a monkey could do it.

          8. JamesHRH

            I cannot think of a pro sports team I would want to move to Vegas more than The Raidahs!+100.

          9. PhilipSugar

            Think about it. Every casino will buy tickets. Every cold weather team fans will come to get a package. Come and stay Friday through Sunday……the slowest day they have.Raiders? And Vegas? What goes on stays in Vegas

          10. SFG

            They will move enough people there to turn TX blue : )

          11. studentdotcom

            I seriously believe that one of the extra motives for Bezos will be to stick it to Trump and help turn a state blue. That’s why I think Austin, Philadelphia, and Charlotte make sense. And part of the reason they won’t go with NYC or Boston or Wash DC.

          12. JamesHRH

            Not going to take it that direction today, but in 3 years, it seems possible that many people are OK w Trump policies / results and still gobsmacked at his tone / style.His speech today @ UN was extremely well written, but he delivered it as if he was bored ( the anti-Obama style ) and it was intentionally direct and specific ( a tone that puts a lot of people off, is unsettling ).But the substance was classic American individualism, projected onto world affairs in a logically sound manner.Bezos likely will have other fish to fry.

          13. JLM

            .Pres Trump’s speech at the UN today was the most articulate, logical, focused statement of US foreign policy, perhaps, since Eisenhower.He challenged the “righteous majority” to man up against the “evil minority.”It was an excellent statement of American values with a clear call to action and an unequivocal expression of leadership. With or without the rest of the world, America will lead. There will be no “leading from behind.”As to delivery, he is not a speaker of high theatricality. The content was extraordinary which makes me comfortable that recent changes in the White House have taken root.It approached perfection in its imperfection.Bravo and well played.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          14. Salt Shaker

            Yeah, it’s a shame we all can’t meet the gal who wrote it. (You served me that layup on an ornate, gold leaf platter w/ a big T embossed square center.) His comment about “destroying North Korea” is reckless. Would you have played chicken w/ Hitler if he had nukes? I doubt it. This isn’t “The Apprentice” boardroom, although it often feels as myopic.

          15. LE

            It’s different. Hitler walked the walk. Rocket man so far pretty much is talk.And it appears to be working by the way he is feared and seems unpredictable.In the end an animal is just an animal. It wants to eat and stay alive. Kim has a good thing going for him. Would be hard to believe that he wants it to end. Does he enjoy torking everyone on? Definitely.I hate to trivialize such an important discussion as this with a story like I will tell about the dog that chases the runner. So I am running and the dog chases me all big and bold growing barking full speed. So instead of running away I run like a crazy person toward the dog making noise and appearing dangerous to him. And the dog (this is true it really happens) runs in the other direction. In the end the dog didn’t want to risk his life although he was willing to talk the talk.

          16. Salt Shaker

            You rolled the dice and got lucky, no? Could have easily gone the other way. When Kim felt threatened internally, he didn’t waiver. He killed…even his uncle. You can’t make assumptions Kim has any regard for human life, even his own. Rational logic doesn’t apply here.

          17. JLM

            .It’s even easier than that. Kim is a psychopath who has no regard for anyone or anything other than is own big belly. He is a punk.Militarily, other than the proximity to S Korea and Seoul, NK is not a huge military problem. They can only project force for the first 30 minutes of any war and then it will be a graves registration problem.The big bargaining chip is how much of the north side of Seoul can he hit. Given the range of the actual artillery weapons involved, it is not very much.One has to believe that in the first minute of any shooting war, there are 300 cruise missiles targeted on anything bigger than a mortar. You hit the ammo dumps, the fire direction centers, the command and control, and the guns.This is pretty simple from a military perspective.It is the north side of Seoul which complicates things.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          18. sigmaalgebra

            Time is on Trump’s side: Rocket Boy knows that if he actually does something with his new toys, then the US will “totally destroy” him and his country. So, he will keep being tough right around the mouth..Meanwhile quite a navy is gathering along the NK coastline. That navy can be for naval blockades or shooting, e.g., cruise missiles. Higher gas prices are only the beginning. As shortages build up, Rocket Boy could find that his starving people are really pissed:To send a message to the NK people and military, the US and SK could continue air force drills over NK, some at quite low level. Once at an air show an F-4 went by at low level, maybe with full afterburner, and the sound was never to be forgotten. Just fly some B-1s and F-35s over appropriate chunks of NK real estate and give an intense course in US air power to the starving people of NK. Scary stuff.Maybe Rocket Boy doesn’t have much in air defenses. So, just take a dozen F-15Cs, have them descend to 400 feet off the ground, at Mach 1.5 and full after burner, and then climb out to 60,000 feet or so vertically. That should get the message across.The US could drop some paper with pictures of big platters of nice hot food, right, during the NK winter snows. So, some NK guy, his children already dead, his wife about to die, him about to die could figure that it was either him or Rocket Boy and try to save his own life, bump off Rocket Boy and go for the food.And, Rocket Boy could find that too many of his starving solders didn’t want to shoot at anyone but Rocket Boy.Some SK commandos trained by the US Navy Seals could find their way into the Presidential Palace of the Great Patriotic Leader of the People Rocket Boy and take him out.Then, with so much starvation, and NK winter cold, the NK army could do what Saddam’s army did as the Marines drove to Kuwait City — stand up waving white flags, ready to kiss hands and feet of US and SK soldiers, and eager for food and water. The top staff of Rocket Boy could ask SK and the US “Why did you wait so long?”.

          19. LE

            Dog: I don’t think I got lucky. I think the result would be repeatable. If this wasn’t the case people wouldn’t be able to train animals with relative predictability.Kim: It is not uncommon at all for people to kill others for all sorts of reasons. Anyone who watches 48 Hours, Dateline or reads the paper sees quite frequently what appear to be normal everyday people from all walks of life committing murder. For what appears to be not even as ‘good’ of a reason than when Kim killed his uncle. Even less people (statistically) end up doing serial murder or a mass event, right? It’s small compared to the people who will do a single killing. And there are vastly more nutty people who would never kill at all. But they do all sort of other things.So I don’t think you can in any way compare what Kim did with his uncle or even in his own country killing with deciding to end it all with nuclear weapons. Or what Hitler did over time with a grand plan. And look at Putin for that matter plenty of killing people who oppose but nobody thinks he will end it all and this didn’t play out in the cold war either, right? And I am not talking about killing others as much as ending the good gig you have going for yourself living that kind of life. It would be like an addict ending the source of supply that gets them high.

          20. PhilipSugar

            Mmmmmm, I had an American Bulldog I had to send to a farm. She went to a real farm. The one before was the sweetest, smartest dog I ever had, I still tear up thinking of her.That thing was mean as hell. She was all left because there was nothing right about her.I had two trainers quit. They said walk her with weights to get out her aggression. I put two 25lb weights on her back, and walked her morning and night. Might as well have given out shivs in the prison yard. Just made her big and mean.She loved the family, but she had nothing but hate in her heart for anything else.Broke a second floor window and was going to jump on the cable guy from the upstairs porch roof. Ate an entire red hornets nest and as they stung, just got meaner and ate more of them. Groundhogs, cats? I made some runs to the work dumpster.The vet who did the exam when I gave her away? The new owner didn’t muzzle her. 19 stitches in the hand.Your theory works until you hit crazy. You can’t fix crazy or stupid.

          21. LE

            No question what you say is true about crazy.But let’s look at this rationally.- Kim would have to be really crazy and not care about what happens with his life going forward. He’s young and got to where he is simply by birth. He’s not even Trump in that sense who actually broke a sweat to get to where he is now. The percentage of crazy dogs and crazy people statistically is low as far as what you are describing. What’s the chance that Kim is that person? The chance of a plane crashing or a pilot crashing a plane.- All the people who surround Kim and have it really good would also have to go along and/or not stop coup what is happening. I am sure there are many steps that have to be taken for some button to be pushed even in retaliation of a first strike.You fly all the time. But many people are fearful of flying and won’t fly at all because of what they perceive as a risk. I think that’s a bit like how people view Kim. Look at the comment salt shaker made comparing him to Hitler. They are not even close to being the same level of crazy.I say the reason that prior administrations let them get away with shit is because they have analyzed and are thinking he isn’t a threat or his father wasn’t a threat. That they can be managed. These are people that have it good. Not people who overthrew and are for the downtrodden and will go to the mat. Not Fidel Castro in other words.

          22. PhilipSugar

            Trump has issues because of his upbringing and his status.This guy? Full on crazy.Fidel Castro? I don’t think crazy. Nasty? Yes. Hate U.S. Yes. not full on crazy.This is like the son of a crazy person who never had to work. He doubles down on crazy.

          23. JLM

            .So, Salty, are you suggesting that Pres Trump did not personally write his speech? Wow!Play along we me on this one — everybody in the Oval Office has a few speechwriters. Could that be true?What is reckless is having fucked with a nuclear North Korea for almost three decades. Clinton started it with his absurd $4B Dane geld. Bush did nothing. Obama and his “strategic patience” — WTF is that?One of the things I like about Pres Trump is his willingness to attack things that others have been kicking down the road.He has said the adult thing, “Hey, Kim, the road is at an end. Now, we fix this and you.” “Fix” in an analogy like fixing, castrating, a dog.American threats — the whole red line shtick — were not credible. Now, they are. That is a good thing. Like anything else, it has to be used in the right proportions.You are unable to “see” the danger here because you hold a single lens. I have no problem with that.But, the idea of a nuclear capable NK with ICBMs and a miniaturized weapon on top of them scares the crap out of me.I like the shows of force, the discussion of a nuclear South Korea/Japan, and a blunt threat to NK.Sic semper tyrannis.Right now, all the shitheads in the world — ISIS, Taliban, Pakistan, Iran, Venezuela, North Korea, Cuba — are on notice that the US is choosing sides and willing to act. That is the way it should be.Fierceness in peace prevents bloodshed in war.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          24. JamesHRH

            Kim is no Hitler.

          25. sigmaalgebra

            Yes, I watched it and got the transcript from the White House Web site and confirmed that the “destroy” Dumb Dung Dong Rocket Boy land was there and not just added at the UN.It was terrific. For speaking quality, he was darned convincing as in he’s not someone to mess with, and that’s the main point.He never said in just what sense the option would be to totally destroy? He meant even Dumb Dung Dong Rocket Boy’s French wine cellar? Even that, too? What about the Mercedes of the Great Patriotic Leader of the People, Dumb Dung Dong Rocket Boy?I believe that the speech was beautifully and carefully written.Uh, the “total” adjective was maybe aimed also at Ayatollah Kockamamie and any other dirt bag ever who wants to buy some DIY plutonium kit, read Fun, Profit, and Political Power with Lithium Deuteride, Short Lessons in von Neumann Solid Geometry, DIY H-bomb kit, DIY backyard solid fuel rocket kit, and DIY missile guidance kit with complete instructions for the “Old take over the world ploy”.

          26. Vendita Auto

            From an international view that will be effected macho BS one tends to agree with the line: “Never react to evil in such a way as to augment it.” “he’s not someone to mess with” Never heard of Dumb Dung Dong ? do remember a Timothy McVeigh though

          27. SFG

            Yep! I think Texas. Turning it blue would give Mr. B a fat ol’ woodie.

          28. PhilipSugar

            And that attitude is what lost the last election and why we have Trump. That is why we got Trump. When will people understand this? Why can’t people understand this? This is why we got what we have…..it blows my mind.Shit, I might be tempted to vote for him next time just to piss you off.Do people get this or they just say RED!!!! BLUE!!!!

          29. Salt Shaker

            Phil, I think people really do get it (certainly post election). What’s amazing is that so many who voted for him–the disenfranchised, if you will–honestly believe he has their best interests at heart. That’s where the real disconnect lies among those who didn’t vote for him. Less about why he won, and more about how/why they think he’s their savior. Is there opportunity? Sure, but to date it’s been just a lot of talk, confusion, dysfunction, lack of clarity of vision and results on big policy issues.

          30. PhilipSugar

            I think the guy is a horses arse. Can’t stay on message period. Either his staff is awful or he won’t follow them. Either way….that is horrible.How hard is it to stay on message? Damn I suck but I stay on message more than him.But you know why they voted for him? They were pissed off.

          31. SFG

            It was more than “pissed off”. Since we are stooping to name calling at this juncture, let me chime in that HRC is a horses arse who had a hard time staying on her message, if for no other reason, than failing to show up and deliver a message in key states.

          32. JLM

            .It really doesn’t matter why anybody votes for anybody. What matters is they voted and the vote totals.I think HRC could have won if she had been a more empathetic candidate, if she had a soul, if she got off her two-axe handle wide ass and worked her deal.She was deciding on the brand of champagne while DJT was seducing the Rust Belt.She pissed on coal and lost some big coal states.It doesn’t really matter.Having said that, only DJT got the lesson of 2014 and tapped into the anger. He beat the GOPe, the DEMe, the Dems, HRC, the Clinton Machine, the Bushes, the Romneys, the media, the pundits, the pollsters out of the gate.He was a part time, amateur politician who had better vision and feel for the electorate. A blue collar billionaire became the voice, conscience, and champion of the working class because he had an intellectual insight, a superior intellectual insight.Can you imagine how good he gets when he figures this shit out?JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          33. PhilipSugar

            I really hope he figures it out. Damn so easy. Stay on message, stay on message. Oh, and I agree completely

          34. sigmaalgebra

            I am suspecting that Trump has worked out a nice, well baited newsie, Democrat paw trap:Notice in his UN speechWe will stop radical Islamic terrorism because we cannot allow it to tear up our nation, and indeed to tear up the entire world.So, he’s back to “radical Islamic terrorism”.But, but, but I read with the highest authority that McMaster had told Trump never to say that! And the newsie pundits were rubbing their hands with glee (can buy that stuff at Amazon; what brands?) over how Trump had been forced to mend his campaign ways.So, for the paw trap: He knows that the newsies will go on and on spouting whatever absurd gossip garbage they can get some drunk sleeping in a dumpster, or just imagine such, to say against Trump. So, Trump lets that nonsense go on.So, the target vermin take the bait! Then Trump springs the trap: Nope, we’re still talking about radical Islamic terrorism. “CLANG!” Sorry, newsie pundits! That right, front paw of your’s, does that hurt?Nope, there was no DACA deal. Sorry, newsie, next time don’t believe Nasty Nancy.Nope, The Wall WILL get built.Nope, there will be NO amnesty. We’re not talking about amnesty. Yes, we WILL R&R ObummerCare. And, yes, we won’t just kick the can down the road again because there is no more road.Then for the tax program, Trump is going on the road again. More rallies. IIRC, the leading candidate rally locations are in states and districts where Democrat Members of Congress are vulnerable.So, I suspect he is figuring it out.

          35. JamesHRH

            This is sinking in with Rep. Dems not getting it.Heard on NPR his AM – Obama For. Sec who is close to Mattis, didn’t take job in trump admin due to conflict in values.She felt UN speech was poor b/c it treated US as equal to other nations.’We are special. We should do more.’

          36. JLM

            .If one takes a look at policy, rather than “feelings”, it is easy to see that Pres Trump has strengthened his support.If you work in energy, steel, construction, lumber, coal — you love the guy.How could you not?If your focus is on foreign policy or immigration, you will have specific actions to approve of.If you are focused on the SCOTUS — you are high on the guy.Feelings are not the same as policy. He’s doing great on policy.The same people who opposed him based on feelings continue to do so and the media continues to allow him to completely dominate the agenda and reporting.Take a look at the Emmys. A complete bust, declining viewership — Trump owned their minds all night long.It is too easy.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          37. JamesHRH

            I’m not sure Trump is going to be a disaster. I am starting to lean towards wildly successful being more likely than wild disaster.

          38. PhilipSugar

            If he can stay on message, and he gets the right message.Now the media is just as bad. And they don’t understand that their hate just fuels the other sides hate as well.I mean seriously bust on the first lady for wearing high heel shoes before she gets on AirForce1 to fly to Houston? I mean just harp on it.Does anybody in their right mind think there isn’t a full wardrobe on that plane for her and the President???? I mean shit there is at least one if not several people that’s sole job is to make sure all of his wardrobes all over are clean, pressed, laid out, and ready.

          39. JamesHRH

            The real hope is that all this BS underbrush gets burnt to the ground during his Presidency.

          40. Donna Brewington White

            A profound lesson we have been given the opportunity to learn and yet it does not seem to be sinking in.Intrigued by Nate Silver’s prolonged and agonized wrestling with the election and why he and others got it wrong. I respect his effort.https://fivethirtyeight.com

          41. Twain Twain

            AI, the polls and surveys don’t understand emotions or language.Mark Zuckerberg this week: “I don’t want anyone to use our tools to undermine democracy. That’s not what we stand for.”Kevin Roose, NYT: “Its engineers are in the business of building apps and selling advertising, not determining what constitutes hate speech in Myanmar.”Unfortunately, Silicon Valley isn’t awake to the problems with the tools themselves — not just the way people use them.https://www.nytimes.com/201

          42. PhilipSugar

            Really disappoints me. The guy is just a jackass. He proved once again he can’t stay on message with his NFL comments.Why bring that up? Why divide people like that? Jackass. Not Presidential.So disappoints me. I guess it is where we are at….divide and conquer. Both sides are guilty I thought he must have been goaded into saying it. Nope, he did on his own. He either means to divide or is stupid. Maybe he figures it keeps him in the press.I can understand no politics in the workplace. I have made somebody turn their Trump t-shirt inside out to come in the office on election day. He could un turn it when he went to the polls (we give time off to vote)But you are playing the national anthem in the workplace. Do I care if you kneel? No. Put your middle finger up? I do care. Do I agree with your message? No, I think the police have it really tough in bad areas, and it makes them jaded? Yes. So it is complicated. When I was doing turn arounds the parent company had drivers and they would pick me up at the airport. They were all retired Philly police officers. They all had guns. (it was very convenient, they would just park in the pickup lane and would be chatting with the other officers. I found out you keep your tin (badge) after you retire.)I asked the one who open carried (who happened to be black) do you have to carry? He said: “No, do you know how much bad shit I saw every day for twenty years?” I said I could imagine. He told me no you cannot, you cannot. I don’t trust other humans at this point, I know what they are capable of. I always carry a gun, and I find a shoulder holster most comfortable when I’m driving.

          43. Donna Brewington White

            I admittedly spent a heartbroken weekend over this whole anthem thing. I love this country and when I stand for the national anthem I recognize that I am standing with others with whom I would vehemently disagree. But there is something about standing there together. I remember standing for the National Anthem at the Los Angeles Olympics after glaring at a guy in the row behind me who intentionally and loudly pronounced Nicaragua to sound like the N-word. We both stood.Some things desperately need fixing and I can empathize with the angst that causes people to protest the police brutality issue. But, not a lot of thought went into this particular method of protest and it may backfire. (I have empathy for police officers as well, in general. My sister was on the force — and even though milder beats such as college campuses and airport patrol, she saw enough.)@kidmercury:disqus has been predicting civil war and when we no longer have strong common bonds in spite of our gross differences, civil war, whether real or figuratively, becomes more inevitable.I believe Trump knows exactly what he is doing. Pretty much can get his opponents to do what he wants them to do. He may as well be a puppeteer.

          44. PhilipSugar

            Just makes me sad. I don’t care about your accent, I don’t care about your size or shape.

          45. realposter

            Come on 50k people is not enough to turn a state the size of Texas….

          46. realposter

            Except turning a state the size of Texas from one to another (political party) is not realistic.

          47. PhilipSugar

            Texas is not red, it is not blue. It is Texas. By God, Texas. Take it from somebody born in Fort Worth in the 1960’s. We like LBJ. We like Lady Bird, Luci Bird, Lynda Bird We don’t care if you are Gay, Baptist, Catholic, Muslim, Jewish. Black, Latino, or White….who pushed through the Civil Rights Act?We do damn care about people that think they know better than us and want to infringe on our rights, given to us by God, Texas.

          48. JLM

            .Phil, good to see you finally coming out of your shell.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

    2. JamesHRH

      Nice teaser at the end there.

    3. Girish Mehta

      The question, like the Wanamaker quote on advertising, being…. which half ?

      1. JLM

        .”More than half … ” No half.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

        1. Girish Mehta

          Did not escape my attention….but 51% is more than half, and 99% is also more than half. And you are a bit of a wordsmith.

          1. JamesHRH

            G – easy on the literal interpretations Hoss 😉

          2. Girish Mehta

            Joking. Somebody needs to call out @JLM:disqus when he drops teasers like that, no ? Especially since he repeated that line.I am going with 50.5% of what he said as true.

          3. JLM

            .Pro tip: nudge it higher.The Chamber is already passing the hat for the Amazon welcome party.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          4. JamesHRH

            LOL.I’m kidding too – need a ‘ winking ‘ font to go with my need for a ‘ slightly sarcastic ‘ font.

          5. JLM

            .Settling in nicely, Jimmie. Survived your first hurricane. Extra credit for the natural use of “hoss.”Well played.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

    4. Matt Zagaja

      I hope both either you or Fred are right. Amazon landing where I am in Boston would be an armageddon level destruction of what is left our housing market and transit system.

      1. kidmercury

        i think boston is the most likely candidate. huge amounts of talent. cities and suburbs that can offer competitive corporate welfare. large and diverse enough for the right kinds of network effects to occur.

      2. Rob Underwood

        Think further north. That I know this is not a distribution center. If not NYC why not southern NH or southern Maine? Land, housing, and still easy access to Boston.

        1. PhilipSugar

          No for the same reason they won’t go to Wilmington, DE which has four of their million square foot distribution centers within 15 miles. Right in the middle of the East Coast. 1:15 by train to NYC and DC. City Center to City Center. 20 min to PHL closer than their current HQ to SEA.You are going to have to transfer a ton of people in addition to hiring new ones.Those people currently live in Seattle. So you have to think where can I send them and they and their families will be happy. While I love and think Wilmington,DE which HQ many big banks the issue will be that it doesn’t have the reputation, unfairly maybe but just the case.Seattle employees are going to have a big sway in this decision.

          1. Rob Underwood

            I think Seattle folks could find A LOT to love about Portland, Maine (or Brooklyn, NY).

          2. PhilipSugar

            I love Portland was there this summer with the family. I think they could find a lot to love about Wilmington, DE but they just don’t have the reputation. Brooklyn, yes but I think still a bit too Urban for people that are used to Seattle.

          3. JamesHRH

            This argument makes Austin a near lock.Mutually agreeable funk + suburban ease levels.

          4. sigmaalgebra

            So, for the families, as they start to leave, they get pennies on the dollar for their old house. Then as their destination is known, they pay dollars on pennies for their new house. They can’t afford that.It’s long been a terrible disease for big companies: As they grow, the local housing costs rise; new employees flatly can’t afford the real estate there; and the company will have to pay the new employees much more than the old ones, then also pay the old ones the same and can’t afford that; and, worst of all, the more the company pays the higher the real estate prices go and the more the company has to pay. The people who sell out and move away get super happy, and everyone else is on a nearly impossible uphill fight of housing costs.So, the lucky ones sell their little 1500 square foot house for 20 times what they paid for it, and to heck with a job with the company; instead go into the real estate business or just do something a long way away.Families get terrible strains; marriages end; children get hurt; the whole thing is a story from hell.

      3. John Revay

        My sense is that it will be BEAN town > MIT et al

    5. PhilipSugar

      Here is the big thing. I think they want East Coast……BUT you have to think ok where can I transfer employees from Seattle and they will willing go?Austin has a big advantage here.Seattle and Austin are similar. NYC? DC? Not so much.

    6. Rob Larson

      Have to admit, when I heard the announcement, my first thought was “Austin”. Both Austin and Denver have the advantage of offering nice lifestyles, with a relatively low cost of living. Austin has an additional advantage in that Texas[1] has fewer building restrictions than other states – whose NIMBY restrictions on building make it hard for housing supply to keep pace with demand, so that as most cities grow in density, they become much more expensive to live in. People trying to buy a house in Seattle are suffering from this right now. Seattle pricing has exploded over the past number of years. Of course Bezos is well aware of the implications. If it’s expensive for your employees to live in your city, you have to pay them more to get them to come / stay. So in my opinion Texas (Austin or Houston) is most likely to be able to absorb an Amazon influx without housing prices going completely crazy.If Bezos isn’t prioritizing housing prices & employee lifestyles and is just prioritizing places where it will be easy to find lots of talented people already living there, then Boston or NYC starts to make more sense – it’s hard to compete with those talent bases.But my guess is that he’s playing the long game here and will go with Denver or Austin/Houston, probably Austin.[1] That’s if my understanding is correct–I heard an interview with a housing economist talking about the cumulative impact of municipal & neighborhood regulations on construction and its impact on housing prices, and his take was that Texas was unique in this regard, that it prevents neighborhood and municipalities from enacting NIMBY regulations that discourage construction, and as a result cities in Texas are uniquely able to let housing supply grow to match demand, keeping prices relatively stable compared to the dramatic price increases that happen in other states. I do know that Austin prices have grown quite a bit in recent years, so maybe the theory isn’t working as well anymore, or maybe they’ve just been building nicer houses over the past few years.

      1. PhilipSugar

        Bezos will make the final call no doubt. But there are going to be 1,000 people along with their spouses/partners/kids that are going to have to make the move. Think about that. They are used to Seattle They will have a pull.

        1. LE

          I think that when you are a business like Amazon that is less important than it would be for a company like Boeing. And let’s face it if you ask the kids (employees = kids) they will want to be in a place that wouldn’t serve any business purpose for Amazon. So nothing is going to really make that much of a difference with that. I don’t think Bezos is particularly worried about losing employees and in fact it may be a way to actually thin the herd a bit. He can always pay more or give another incentive to people he really wants to move/keep and those that don’t want to move will lose their jobs.To my other point my guess is that Bezos is manipulating various higher level people to achieve his goal as well. It’s all a game.Lastly remember there is a big buzz about this move. So even the most reticent wife and family will strongly consider relocating because it just seems like a big deal.

          1. PhilipSugar

            It will make a difference. Now is he using other cities and states to pit themselves against each other??? Hell yes.

          2. awaldstein

            Agree completely.It is all about the people and families.Work in LA a lot now and relocating there is a huge plus for that very reason.

          3. Susan Rubinsky

            I actually think Amazon HQ2 is a good exercise for the entire nation.

          4. PhilipSugar

            If it highlights the fact that we need to curb these tax breaks/incentives/enticements that are a race to the bottom.It really bothers me that states/cities break their rules for certain companies and not others.That really should end. One set of rules for everyone.Do you think if you are a small company that is gradually and steadily growing you are going to get a “package” like they are looking for?Does that put you at a disadvantage? Yes.Do I think that there are some dirty deals that get done? Yes. Too much money involved.

          5. Susan Rubinsky

            That’s a great reason, Philip (did you see Seth Godin’s blog about that this week?) There are other positive reasons for this as well. It gets local/regional governments, publicly funded agencies and non-profits to think about their assets (and their weaknesses) in new ways.

          6. PhilipSugar

            No, I will look, but the one point I didn’t make was that it allows people to not address the issue.It allows government employees to “band-aid” things.And get corrupted.If you are Etsy? Do you get the same treatment as what people want to give Amazon? I don’t think so.That is wrong.If you are Tom Brady do you get different rules applied to you? (Well you are a serious complainer) but no you should not.

      2. ShanaC

        Denver has a growing tech community, has cheap real estate and has plenty more being built within Boulder County (there is a surplus of apartments in Boulder County right now ),CO is much more active in bringing in tech to CO, and RTD is getting very serious about building even more mass/rapid transit (Denver-Pueblo is bidding for Elon Musk’s Hyperloop)Colorado is being purposely friendly to tech – Texas isn’t. If Amazon moves to Texas, it will be fighting the legistlature all the way about policies for the state at large. Makes no sense.Plus CO is much more centrally located for flights to various places in the US – makes doing business in CO easy

        1. Rob Larson

          Agreed that Denver is a strong contender, for many of the reasons you list. I handicap it as the 2nd most likely destination, but I could be wrong.Regulation-wise, my perception is that in some ways Colorado is more business-friendly, and in other ways Texas is more business-friendly. Regardless, both are ahead of California, Massachusetts, and NY.

    7. TeddyBeingTeddy

      It’ll either be Austin or Chicago. Austin has UT, it’s a place people want to live, and it’s cool. Chicago will likely offer the most economic incentives, it has the top schools, it’s geographically well positioned for logistics (same reason ORD is busy). So to me it comes down to Austin or Chicago. Charlotte is probably a distant third. Detroit will make a compelling case but ultimately lose because no management will actually want to live there.NYC is an expensive over crowded dump. The terrorism risk is too large, and there’s not enough good schools there.You heard it here second!

      1. Rob Underwood

        “The Boston gig has been cancelled…I wouldn’t worry about it though, it’s not a big college town.” – Ian Faith, This is Spinal Tap.

        1. TeddyBeingTeddy

          Boston has amazing schools, i just think its too far east and cost of living way to high.

      2. curtissumpter

        I know. NY doesn’t have enough good schools.Cornell. Columbia. NYU.One step above Phoenix if you ask me.

        1. TeddyBeingTeddy

          Far away. Eh. No engineers.

          1. Rob Underwood

            Far away? Roosevelt Island, Upper Manhattan, and the Village?

          2. TeddyBeingTeddy

            Cornell is far, colombia is eh, and NYC is a freak show by day and Wall St folks by night. all great schools im just not sure its a great fit fot AMZN. johns pizza on NYC campus da bomb though!

          3. realposter

            Amazon just took 360K Sq ft. to move technical talent to in NYC…

          4. PhilipSugar

            The biggest problem is that as you say making $200k in NYC means you scrape by. Think the king of low margins is going to do that?

          5. Rob Underwood

            Yes, a family of 5 needs to $200K household to not only get by buy also be able to put away a bit for college and retirement. It sounds like a lot elsewhere but it’s not a lot here.

      3. CW

        Charlotte is an interesting dark horse. It’s one of the fastest growing cities in the country, has a major airport, great logistics capabilities, a “real” downtown with enough space to build a true urban campus, and its in a business friendly purple state on the East Coast. It doesn’t have the “cool” brand of an Austin or Denver but millennials are moving there every day and there are a ton of great schools nearby to attract talent from (UNC, Duke, Georgia Tech, Virginia Tech, NC State, Clemson, etc.).A more detailed and well laid out case for why is here: https://twitter.com/AdieTom

        1. JamesHRH

          That’s a good call and no one is running Charlotte any sun.

        2. JLM

          .Charlotte is a dark horse for sure, but it is a different kind of city. It is a huge finance hub.It is the New South updated from the Old South. It is not wildly progressive (bankers) and it has a splash of racial tension.They have a pro basketball and football team. They have a lot of land in the periphery. It is a “cool” city but not on the scale of an Austin or New Orleans or Charleston.They don’t have much high tech. NC has great schools.I am not sure the city would want Amazon.#1 son is an investment banker in Charlotte and he likes it but says, “It’s not Austin.”JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          1. CW

            Agreed – the tech scene is just ok and it doesn’t have a reputation for being cool (and is not as cool at Austin). Both very solvable problems if Amazon comes to town! I do think a large % of tech talent in places like Atlanta or Raleigh (in addition to all the schools mentioned) would be happy to move to Charlotte for a job with Amazon.

      4. JamesHRH

        Suburban Detroit is awesome., as is the UP, w quick access to NW Ontario wilderness.

        1. TeddyBeingTeddy

          Agreed. they have suburbs that rival the very best in the US…surprisingly. has good engineering schools and rent will be nearly free. makes economic sense but just too undesirable for too many talented people.

    8. Twain Twain

      Yup, Austin.

    9. SFG

      The people who love NYC love it. The people who don’t love it could never imagine living there. It’s too dam cold, expensive, noisy, and dirty. AMZN needs space.

      1. JLM

        .I love NYC. It is like going skiing. A month a year?JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

      2. ShanaC

        true, my fiance likes NYC more now that he’s moved out.

    10. Pete Griffiths

      I don’t see NYC.Austin is def a possible.Lots of ‘liberals’ don’t much like Texas but do like Austin.

    11. Ray Schmitz

      If most of this was true, then Austin’s fix got rained out by Harvey. Amazon must have reluctantly abandoned the plan to rush out a HQ2 RFP, because state officials won’t announce a huge corporate subsidy package early in the Houston cleanup process.NYC has less chance than it really deserves given the very long list of favorables. The Achilles heel is cost of living, that is, housing affordability. It is a problem of the city’s own making. We pretend that rent regulated units and single rooms that are “preserved” actually contribute to a solution. Wrong, no matter how many of those anyone promises.Addressing the issue with reforms conducive to substantial new housing stock construction would enhance livability and make NYC a strong favorite to locate a business HQ of any size. So yes, Amazon should set up here – and the one thing any NYC proposal needs most is to talk about how we will handle housing.

      1. JLM

        .The fix was in long before that bastard Harvey showed up.Nobody wants a disaster like Harvey, but if one was not proud to be a Texan, then it gave everybody a reason to be prouder still.The management of the crisis by the Governor, the counties, the city of Houston (Dem Mayor Turner) was superb.Amazon came to Texas a long time ago to look at Whole Foods. That courtship lasted more than three years. When the stock price was half of what it had been, Amazon made their move.You notice there was no opposition or drama. Why? The deal was made between two guys who’d known each other for a long time.I can already see the changes in my local WF (the flagship store at 6th and Lamar, down the way from #1 store).I should probably start trying to line up some bets.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

        1. sigmaalgebra

          Why in heck does Bezos want Whole Foods? He has a thing about carrots, lettuce, and celery?

          1. ShanaC

            employees got to eat

          2. sigmaalgebra

            You are saying that Bezos wanted WH as a grocery store and kitchen for the Amazon employees?

    12. PhilipSugar

      One thing I want to stress this highlights the fact that we need to curb these tax breaks/incentives/enticements that are a race to the bottom.It really bothers me that states/cities break their rules for certain companies and not others.That really should end. One set of rules for everyone.Do you think if you are a small company that is gradually and steadily growing you are going to get a “package” like they are looking for? NoDoes that put you at a disadvantage? Yes.Do I think that there are some dirty deals that get done? Yes. Too much money involved.

      1. LE

        Not going to happen. It’s competition. And I am not sure that states could even collude among themselves and agree to this. And you’d never get them to all agree even if it was legal to do so.Do you think that a state will agree not to do this? Why should they? Especially if their ‘competition’ is doing it. And you know what I say about that.Part of the problem here is that the people who do the negotiations allow themselves to be rolled. Plenty of that is self serving.

        1. PhilipSugar

          Federal law.

    13. Richard

      northern Florida would be a nice option and as an added bonus for jeff bezos it just might change the state from red to blue as well as help his space voyage company.

    14. Richard

      Orlando and its a swing state! Bezos could change the next and future elections with this move.

      1. JLM

        .Amazon employs 341K total employees worldwide. It is looking for up to 50K workers at HQ2.This slice of the electorate — youngish tech — does not really vote. They are in the 12% range.The people who vote are the people at the Villages, the gray hairs. They vote at the 98% rate.Florida, post Irma and with the Cuba turnabout, is going to be pretty hard Trump territory. Even Mickey Mouse voted for Trump.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

    15. ShanaC

      Bet you it will be denver

  2. Rob Underwood

    NYC is the right choice. And by “NYC” I mean Brooklyn!Seriously, solid list of reasons HQ2 should come here. I think the commitment to CSforAll is top of the list along with our diversity.Brooklyn in particular is pushing for this and I am excited to do whatever I can to make it happen.And Denver? fuggedaboutit!https://twitter.com/brookly

  3. bogorad

    I just don’t think Bezos is ready to commit to a place being ran by socialists – both NYC and NYS 😉

    1. Salt Shaker

      Have you been to Seattle lately? Socialism is in the water.

      1. JamesHRH

        This is a good point.JB doesn’t strike me as a socialist, just an independent….possible libertarian.Mostly, he reminds of William Randolph Hearst, but with the discipline of Wall St.

  4. Tom Labus

    11. Cornell Tech Center. 12. The High Line13. You can walk everywhereand they can bring some good coffee to NYC too

    1. Pointsandfigures

      Coffee regular doesn’t matter what kind of black coffee you have 🙂

  5. Ron Shah

    As a founder, I am split on this one. Love the idea the idea of bigger investment dollars and talent gravitating to NYC. But as NYC founders, we are already subject to insane salary dollars being thrown at developers by Facebook, Twitter.. adding Amazon to the mix makes it only harder to recruit top talent when you can’t match their cash. Not all the developers you need will be entrepreneurial.

    1. Rob Underwood

      Not today’s topic but there is tons of NYC dev talent outright sitting on the side lines or locked up in low paying dead end jobs. The hiring managers are not looking in the right places.

      1. Matt Zagaja

        Hiring is a tough skill. I know that from experience. Much easier to chase folks with big names on the resume than actually figure out how to hire.

        1. Rob Underwood

          NYC tech is great and I’m a huge fan. But it has too big problems: 1) lack of liquidity events that pump capital back in the ecosystem, and 2) age discrimination.I have worked in Silicon Valley and while age discrimination is an issue there too my perception is that because “computer programmer” has been a popular job there for many decade, people get it that there can, you know, be computer programmers over the age of 30.That’s not the case in NYC right now. Hiring is limited to those who are under 30 and either 1) are coming here from a top flight school like Stanford or 2) just got out of a bootcamp program. The startups, recruiters, and large corporations who look for tech talent lament the lack of developers but they do a truly lousy job of looking beyond their comfort zone of young white people. They just aren’t looking.Apparently people who rather see their startup’s tech stack built by people who a year ago didn’t know a lick of code rather than trust people who have decades of experience. Imagine taking this approach to literally any other engineering field.

  6. jason wright

    that would be the ever greater concentration of power in one city. very unhealthy for a nation (i’m English – see London). why do you think people voted for Trump? because they have been ignored. just because people live in the hinterland doesn’t mean they don’t have talent and ambition. NYC should get on with creating new companies for itself, and stop cherry picking.

    1. Rob Underwood

      Trump the NYC native who lives in a golden palace high above Manhattan?

      1. JLM

        .Is he related to Trump, the anger-mining, populist, who got off his ass and went to the hinterlands to speak to/for the deplorables?The blue collar billionaire?Are they related?JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

        1. Rob Underwood

          Same guy I hear.

          1. JLM

            .I think we better check this out. Not jump to any conclusions.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

      2. jason wright

        if any other candidate had offered the hinterlanders something he wouldn’t now be where he is.

        1. Rob Underwood

          As I have said here before I thought he could (not would) win because of the under- and un-employment of my 1st cousins on both sides who live in places like Arizona, Colorado, and New Hampshire. The lack of economic opportunity is very real.There is a massive displacement of workers happening, disproportionally impacting people 1) in rural areas and 2) in their 40s and 50s. But it’s spreading. I’m seeing it and feeling it. I am watching folks in places like Brooklyn with graduate degrees who can’t find gig work, let along full time work. The “full employment” and “robust economy for jobs” is bulls**t. It’s starting to hit the coasts now and mark my words it will impact the next election cycle — it won’t just be “working class whites” voting based on economic pain. It’s a contagion, likely based at least in part of the automation of white collar work due to AI, and it’s moving up the educational ladder and into more urban areas.See the comment someone already made here about not being able to find dev talent in NYC and that being a reason for Amazon to think twice. That’s just not true — there’s a ton of talent that would love a shot.

        2. JLM

          .One cannot tell Coal Country you intend to bankrupt their industry and kill their jobs and expect them to vote for you.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          1. James Michael

            Hello AVC community. Love you guys/gals!First time post, long time reader.Throwing out my long shot entry…Louisville, Ky.*Liberal city in a conservative state.*Can pull talent Regionally / Nationwide.*Fantastic city for a family w/ realistic home value*Great school options for the kidos.*Reliable driving routes w/out the headaches.*Tax incentives already negotiated before.And as a sleeper city, Louisville would be smart for Amazon, as they are in the logistics biz first and foremost and their next takeover is UPS/FedEx.Food is just a division, Logistics is the goal…”We estimate a $400 billion-plus market opportunity for Amazon in delivery, freight forwarding, and contract logistics”http://fortune.com/2017/02/…

          2. sigmaalgebra

            Being at FedEx at one time, I wondered about Amazon and FedEx now. And, yes, Bezos bought some cargo planes.But, really, my guess is that for Amazon, the main means of moving goods will be boats (over the oceans), trains for big shipments over land, 18 wheel trucks for most of the shipping volume to the warehouses, and then small trucks or drones for the last mile. So, minimal use of airplanes. So, no FedEx or Memphis for Amazon.Uh, airplanes are, in a word, expensive. Sure, maybe blimps, but not airplanes.

  7. Vendita Auto

    Read the big token/ bitcion gamble is on Juneau

  8. JamesHRH

    Ok, I’m a newbie here in Houston, but……I think Houston:Is at least on par w NYC on: 1,2,3,5,7,8,9,10.4 you have us but we have NASA!6 is the main reason NYC will not get AHQ2. Same for H town.

    1. JLM

      .Houston is underrated while NYC is overrated.People miss the international aspect of H’ton. It has become a huge gateway to Mexico, Central Am, South Am. The energy industry carries it everywhere. It is the center of LNG.I remember when Houston was oil, oil, oil, and NASA. with really bad traffic before 610 and 6 were built.It is a different city now.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

      1. JamesHRH

        That is the eye opener to us – the globalness and diversity.Traffic has just moved out – 610 @ Galleria is a constant snarl, I10 is brutal during rush hour…….never enough toads here they say.

  9. gorbachev

    They should build their HQ somewhere where the cost of living would attract tech workers from the overpopulated and expensive tech hubs for half the salary.

    1. Guy Lepage

      >half the salary:( You just removed the only incentive for a developer to move from an amazing place such as NYC or the valley. If it was a slight pay drop then I think you’d see a lot more tech hubs start to actually compete with NYC and the valley.

    2. JamesHRH

      Denver, ATX, Charlotte win that hands down, it appears.

    3. Tom Labus

      Good to see you out and about Mr G

    1. JamesHRH

      Earlier, someone mentioned that programmers typically don’t do cool well.Exhibit A.Note how he hides the wrong town name? Dude was the Boss of all Performers.

    2. sigmaalgebra

      “My kinda town!” IIRC, that was a Fredo, right? And Fredo got it from Johnny or Frankie, right?I never liked that Frankie music about NYC. Heck, I didn’t even like Bernstein’s effort at music about NYC.I really like music, and NYC is one of the best places for music performance — Heifetz (Oct. 27, 1917, just off the boat, at 16, in Carnegie Hall, opening with the Vitali “Chaconne”,https://www.youtube.com/wat…Elman: “Don’t you think it’s a little warm in here?” Godowsky: “Not for pianists!”), Callas (http://www.google.com/searc…Puccini, “Vissi d’arte,”), Morris (Wotan), etc. Well, when Dvorak was in NYC (Symphony from the New World), Mahler, Stravinsky, okay, but downhill from there?

  10. Pointsandfigures

    If I was being objective, I’d look at 4-5 cities for Amazon. Chicago, Dallas, Atlanta, Toronto, DC, or possibly Pittsburgh or Indy. Austin doesn’t have an airport. Amazon execs need an international airport with non-stops. The town needs to be big enough to support them, with a decent cost of living and great networking for the execs-along with being a talent draw. I also think they will pick a place in the center of the country, or east of the Mississippi. That means a place like Denver or California is out. Remember, Amazon is a tech company so they need tech talent-but they also want to be a media company and a food company. They are going to need marketing and distribution/logistic talent as well. Notice, Google’s second largest office is in Chicago.

    1. BillMcNeely

      Downside to Dallas is the poor public transportation system but Ft Worth may be a good choice

      1. Susan Rubinsky

        Dallas-Ft. Worth is considered one region. The Amazon bid package specifically indicates that they are accepting only one bid package per MSA (Metropolitan Statistical Area).

    2. JamesHRH

      If you are Bezos, one of the best things about Seattle is that no one poaches your execs while they are networking.That favours ATX, IMO.I really liked ATL until I did a quick search and realized the transit / traffic issues there.

    3. ShanaC

      Denver does

  11. kidmercury

    1. does NYC have enough real estate?2. cost too much3. most significantly, amzn is looking for a corporate welfare, i doubt nyc can compete with other cities in this regard

    1. Pointsandfigures

      Figure that being equal. There will be so many tax breaks etc thrown at them it will probably add up to be the same.

      1. JLM

        .Well, unless, like Texas, you don’t have any taxes, eh?JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

        1. kidmercury

          i greatly admire the texas spirit of rebellion and self-sufficiency, but texas also has the 4th highest property tax in the country.

          1. JamesHRH

            YEs, but that is one item to deal with up front and pretty much eliminate.The biggest plus to low regulation is simplicity of operations.I think the NYC long list of hassles is interesting – its the length of the list that becomes the biggest hassle.

          2. JLM

            .Property taxes in God’s Country are enacted by cities, counties, and school districts.A site on the periphery of ATX will have NO City of Austin taxes, have a very low school district tax, and will get a bazillion year property tax credit.The land itself may be owned by a non-taxable entity and rented to Amazon for $1/year.This is the kind of stuff the Texas Opportunity Fund does.If you are a renter, you never see a tax bill. If you have no state income tax, the notion of a slightly higher property tax is not a big deal.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          3. kidmercury

            fair enough, in light of that structure and opportunity i suspect amzn can get around any sizable tax bill without too much trouble.

          4. JLM

            .Amazon is the world’s best sales tax cheat on the planet.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  12. karen_e

    New York has the media landscape, too. Hearts, flowers, puppies.

    1. Tom Labus

      And hot dog vendors

  13. Guest

    Amazon will not touch NYC with a 10-foot pole! Is there a less business-friendly locale in the entire world? Regulations, taxes, high costs, public sector unions running roughshod over the taxpayers, subway system in disrepair. How progressive! Keep dreaming and keep raising taxes!

  14. eliasmoubayed

    Hands down Toronto.

    1. JamesHRH

      Would be interesting to see how much Nationalist pressure gets put on him if he pulls that lever.

  15. Kirsten Lambertsen

    Wouldn’t Detroit or Flint be an amazing choice on many levels?

    1. SFG

      As long as everyone is ok bathing with bottled water!

  16. Frank W. Miller

    Sorry, we’d like to have it in Denver… 😉

    1. ShanaC

      Hello new neighbor!

  17. awaldstein

    I”m all in on NYC.I have already sent this to my contacts within Amazon and of course the throwaway to [email protected] which I know from personal experience gets sent on.Two things I might add:-Gateway to Europe. No small thing.-All if any talks of closeness to Whole Foods and Austin are from my opinion way overplayed. This was in no way a consummation of love, it was a bidding war. East I believe regardless will be the destination.

    1. JLM

      .I’ve known John Mackey (WF CEO, founder) since his first store on Lamar Blvd. He took WF as far as he could.John & Jeff cut this deal because Bezos promised to keep WF headquartered in Austin.They were sniffing each other when the price was twice what it turned out to be. Amazon bit because they could buy it for half of what they could three years ago. They were afraid of a rising stock market dragging it out of their comfort zone.Amazon paid $13.7 billion for Whole Foods. How does that stack up to other acquisitions?Twitch, 2014, $0.97 billion.Zappos, 2009, $0.93 billion.Kiva, 2012, $0.78 billion.Quidsi (Diapers.com), 2010, $0.55 billionElemental, 2015, $0.30 billionSo, in your book, Arnold, Whole Foods is a head fake? You think a guy makes the largest acquisition in the history of his company without a long term plan?It is the largest acquisition in the history of Amazon — by more than 10X. Do you think Bezos and Mackey didn’t spend some time together?Amazon is also sniffing around looking for a huge data center for AWS. They are considering a plot of ground out by where the City of Austin has a huge solar plant.No, this is not an accident. Why should it be? Seattle and Austin are brothers from the same mother.Point of fact — the Amazon team came to Austin to do the due diligence on WF and that’s when they began to look for sites. Only now are some of the other competitors going to Seattle to have a pow wow with the Amazonians.The. Fix. Is. In.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  18. LE

    should stop thinking about any other place and just pick NYCHah! You can’t extract the maximum concessions if there isn’t a ‘competition’!!

  19. Jeremy Shatan

    As a shareholder, I could not endorse the overhead such a move would require, even though it pains me as a New Yorker to say so. I recently drove past an incredible amount of empty office parks in the Allegheny area just east of Pittsburgh. It would cost them next to nothing and Pittsburgh, home of Carnegie Mellon and other distinguished schools, is quietly becoming a hub of innovation. They have a new airport there, too.

  20. laude05

    NYC is an expensive, crowded place to live. Most people would charged a huge premium to work and live in NYC. Heck, I’d want a million bucks a year more than I would charge anywhere else (except any over-crowded big city) just for the inconvenience of living there.

  21. Salt Shaker

    “Your margin is my opportunity.” What city can afford to grease the skids with the most attractive incentives (e.g. tax abatements)? Bezos wants a bidding war, though he likely already has a strong sense of where he wants to go. Relocation Criteria: East coast, moderate cost of living, avail of reasonably priced RE for corporate build out, good airports, solid infrastructure (AMZN is a major reason why traffic in downtown Seattle is so bad. City planning here is atrocious). Talent is less of a concern. Talent will migrate to wherever AMZN 2 is located given the opportunities they can provide; same as Seattle.My pick: Charlotte, NC. (Similar to Seattle in many ways, including its liberal values.)

    1. JamesHRH

      This is really good idea. Financial hub there also means that exec poaching is limited.

    2. ShanaC

      they’ll be fighting the state, policy wise.

  22. curtissumpter

    This post sounds from an investor and ecosystem point of view excellent.However, I think NYC making a play for Amazon is ill fitting. The reasons primarily being two:1. New York currently has a major infrastructure problem. New York as a city is older than the country it’s in. The infrastructure is just as old. This can not be solved with a digital fix nor can it be solved quickly. This is a decade long problem. The people of the city of New York are constantly complaining about the MTA and the congestion. The problem isn’t the trains nor is it the MTA. The problem is that this city was not designed to transport upward of 9 MM people. It’s a city located on penisulas and islands. It is land constrained and riven with waterways. Locating Amazon’s HQ here would only exacerbate the infrastructure issues.2. New York has a housing crisis. Property values have skyrocketed and so have accompanying rents. Adding another magnet for high income workers and executives will only exacerbate this problem. This will have material consequences. The city of Atlanta has become a creative hub. It is currently becoming a creative and cultural capital that should shortly rival New York. It is the only place that has movie studios and music studios that rival New York. Donald Glover, who creatively grew up in New York and attended NYU, chose to take the Emmy award winning show “Atlanta” to Atlanta. This is not the first casualty of New York’s problems nor will it be the last.The thing that makes New York amazing is the fact that not only do we have the capital markets, technology, an underrated yet world class health care and research sector, as well as the media titans but that is undergirded by the arts as well as a city that mixes classes. By squeezing out non-high income classes and artists who have not yet been inducted into this class we are at risk of losing advertisers who make creative ads, artists, musicians, and the people that make the city run.I’ve been to Silicon Valley. It is quite boring. It would be a shame if New York became a Silicon Valley with a strong financial sector. Shortly afterward the studios, Silvercup, ABC, NBC, CBS, MTV, etc. would be forced to move elsewhere. After this finance professionals and others would want to follow because nothing is worst than having resources and nothing interesting to spend them on.We should be careful that we are not homogenizing the city into a bland yet expensive pablum.

    1. JLM

      .In Seattle, more than 20% of Amazonians walk to work. Housing is a deal killer in NYC.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  23. curtissumpter

    This is such an important issue I feel the need to comment twice and to make a different point.Right now programming skills are in supply and the technology revolution is heavily reliant on them. However I feel the next wave of technology as demonstrated by Apple’s iPhone X AR is going to very quickly require a drove of artists. The problem with programmers is that they (of which I am one) often think like programmers. The human element is sorely lacking as demonstrated by the programmer-centric Reddit interface or any technology pre-Steve Jobs.But with AR and the blending of digital and real world, and I don’t think this trend will even come close to stopping, as well as the constant integration of tech with our physical lives the non-programmer creative class will be more and more important. How much more successful might Siri be if the voice wasn’t so robotic? Perhaps voiceover actors would be appropriate. Elon Musk said one of the most important factors in making Tesla vehicles is that they look “cool”.As much as I enjoy and respect programmers they don’t tend to do cool well. And if you’re going to ask consumers to put something on (wearables) or see something (AR) or hear and interact with something (Siri and digital assistants) it has to be human. It has to be cool and it has to appeal to all classes of people. New York is the perfect lab for that. I’m not sure if another Amazon’s HQ2 plays to that strength.

    1. LE

      I agree. Programmers are boxed in to their way of thinking. Just like attorneys. Just like physicians.Tech wise an example is Google calling the OS “Android”. I have said that many times before. Like even I know that not everyone wants to drive a 7 speed manual. Tech guys are like (famous example from HN) ‘why do we need dropbox just use rsync. They are actually that clueless.But the thing is if the boat is big enough it doesn’t matter if there are all sorts of little leaks and it’s dragging 100 buses as it sails. But then someone like Apple comes along with the iphone who gets people and everything changes. That was all simply looking at usability and how normal people think and operate.The thing is tech types don’t have to worry much about this type of thing as long as the market is growing. Rising tide (ie floats all boats) and all of that.Another example of rising tide? The 100% difficulty with using the remote on my TV set with Fios (Comcast the same). They just can’t make it easy to use. You can’t even use it if the lights are low and if you are over 40 at night.

  24. cjmeijer1

    It has to be Boston! We have the education base, are less expensive than NYC, have an international airport, and most importantly, have already identified a large enough tract of land (Suffolk Downs) that is just 1 train stop from the airport and less then 5 from downtown.Admittedly, housing is tight now, but no where near the price/lack of supply in the NYC area.

  25. Gary Arndt

    Amazon is building their own delivery company to bring their shipping expense in house, and also to compete with FedEx and UPS.This is a major undertaking, and you can’t have the base of a company like that in a costal city. New York’s airports can’t handle that sort the additional air traffic of a shipping hub.They need space. Space for airplanes and a processing center like FedEx has in Memphis.If you’ve flown into Denver, you’ll realize that the area around Denver has LOTS of space. You have one of the largest airports in the world, plenty of cheap land for growth, and a location between the coasts.Moreover, you don’t have to pay the high salaries or rent you would in New York. Most of the programming that would need to be done can still be done out of Seattle.

    1. PhilipSugar

      If that is the case then I give Nashville.If you are shipping Denver has two problems: First the snow, but more importantly the hight. If you are shipping stuff you can’t load a plane as heavy on a hot day and take off from 6,000 feet.

      1. ShanaC

        the summer heat and snow isn’t that much of a problem do to Denver’s location on the eastern slope. The big problem is actually that further up in the rockies, you’ll get tons of afternoon storms in the summer, but that’s a problem for any flight across the rockies, irrespective of if it starts off in denver or not.

    2. ShanaC

      Actually, you would for the programming. Google is in CO

    1. sigmaalgebra

      Yea, but you didn’t mention the gross margins on those red hats! They were, Made in USA, going for, what, $35 a pop? That may be higher margins than Ivanka’s B12, Caviar Complexe Face Creme or some such (may not have this product description just right — I don’t use Face Creme). Sure, I’ll give you a well deserved up vote!

  26. daryn

    What do you think about Newark? Audible HQ is there, and Amazon could buy the entire city.Seems close enough to (maybe?) tap the NYC talent pool yet offer lower cost of living an another attempt at urban revitalization like Zappos tried with Vegas.

    1. JLM

      .Newark is brilliant. I used to say, “When the earth gets an enema, it goes in in Newark.”That was, of course, disrespectful and offensive. I have stopped saying that because I don’t want to be disrespectful and offensive.I think the State of NJ might “give” Newark to Amazon, no?JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

      1. Tom Labus

        Would be very for nj but the pols here

        1. sigmaalgebra

          What could possibly be wrong with NJ? I’ve long heard that it has the best government money can buy?

          1. Tom Labus

            Newark is so far gone it may work.

      2. PhilipSugar

        I would say the same thing except limit it to the U.S. because there are other pits in this world that are worse than Newark. Can you imagine taking a visit there?Seattle has some rough areas but the are kind of grunge rough, Newark is you get killed rough. Seattle has some beautiful views……Newark has some…..of the refinery.I’ll give you another two dark horses. Baltimore, MD. East Coast, big airport, has a really nice harbor, lots of Universities, close to DC, Easy train ride to NYC, has shown it can do redevelopment (Harbor) has spots to place it on the Harbor. Downside: some really shitty sections and other than the burbs or private schools are bad, nightlife.Those are big downsides.I don’t recall if anybody mentioned Nashville, but that is another one.

        1. JLM

          .I used to spend a lot of time in Newark with Mutual Benefit Life, the largest insurance co failure in the US. I used to eat paella and hot dogs with french fries inside the bun.It got a little better, but not much. It is a very dangerous place. I never recall an evening I didn’t hear multiple sirens.The refineries? Ugh.Baltimore got the harbor area renovated and stopped. Go three blocks from the harbor and you better be armed. I used to visit a mutual fund company there which had armed guards in their lobby who would come out to walk you in from your cab.I think some places with recent racial tension (Baltimore, Charlotte) may be disqualified.I think the “cool” lens is way more important than we may think.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

          1. PhilipSugar

            I agree and that is the same problem with Wilmington.Have you been to the “gulch” in Nashville in the last year. Really has become “the” place in the South.Understand I am just throwing out possibilities. As I have said I agree with you that ATX has to be the strong front runner.I’ll give you another reason. Whole Foods technology was it’s Achilles heel. Amazon did not pay that much money to not fix that problem.I think HQ2 will be the place where Amazon runs its physical locations……where is the HQ for those?Finally people are downplaying the I’m transferring you (partner/spouse/kids) to X city. I know they say Amazon doesn’t care but they do care. They are going to send their best people. The ones on the fast track and tell them it’s an opportunity to move up.What do you want them to see and think when the go on a scouting visit?Not holy shit I better look for another job in Seattle.Not damn, they better double my salary because things here are so expensive.I think the vast majority of people from SEA are going to go to ATX and think: Well the climate is not the same, but no taxes, less expensive housing, tons of stuff to do….Ok I can do this. I think Amazon is actively shopping for two reasons:To get the best dealAnd the way to do that is to have the “winner” be able to say look we gave these concessions but we “won” The politicians need to do this.

    2. ShanaC

      Easy enough to expand an already existing HQ

  27. falicon

    For all of these reasons, plus an affordable and controllable environment, Amazon should go to Newark instead…all the benefits of NYC without all the costs and space constraints…

  28. Heather Wetzler

    Personally I think NYC is the worst place for Amazon -I will be super disappointed if they went to NYC(and I am an ex-NY-er). A part of me would love to see them come to LA & have the west coast rock it, but I know that would be bad for the country as well. LA and NYC are killing it – but the rest of the country isn’t doing nearly so well and This gap aggravates all kinds of problems, including inequality and political polarization–and what got that madmen Trump elected. I would love to see them go to Detroit – – BUT I do not think Detroit could support their employment needs(would love to be proved wrong) – -but somewhere like Atlanta could. And Georgia Tech and Atlanta are making some of the smartest and most innovative decisions right now around education and innovative cities. Atlanta could be the future and is very forward thinking for Amazon. And I am sure would be more than happy to give Amazon the Tax breaks it is looking for.Georgie Tech 2021: http://c21u.gatech.edu/Atlanta Innovative City: https://www.atlantastudies….But if not Atlanta – LA:) Amazon is already implementing their curriculum into some 2-years colleges here – – like Santa Monica College which is awesome!!

  29. sigmaalgebra

    Interesting! Maybe correct!(1) NYC is expensive, and Amazon in some ways is cheap. Bezos may upchuck at cost of living and cost of doing business in NYC. But, lot’s of companies in NYC put up with the costs; one reason they do is that for finance and more, Manhattan has a unique, so far indivisible, network effect, are able just to pass on the high costs, do so, and get away with it. It’s not so clear that Amazon has similar reasons to be so tied to NYC.(2) For what Amazon does, they cut deals, faster than the rag trade cuts cloth. Maybe Manhattan is the one best place to cut deals. But as we know, it’s also possible to cut similar deals in, where is it, Bentonville, AR?(3) No telling in what directions Bezos wants to take Amazon. Maybe Manhattan would be a good location to make those directions real. Maybe not. E.g., last I heard, Bezos wants to launch rockets. In NYC he will do that from Central Park? Right, I’m being cruel, SO cruel! Of COURSE it wouldn’t be Central Park; it would be Roosevelt Island! Nope, all of Staten Island! Nope, he’d just take over the Hamptons!(4) On the emphasis on computing in K-12 in NYC or Cornell Tech, somehow I just have a super tough time seeing that such education would help Amazon. E.g., I hate to be cruel, but I doubt that there is a single teacher of computing in NYC or NY who has much understanding of, say, the internal architecture and implementation of AWS or how Bezos gets his billion lines of code a year, or some such, designed, written, tested, monitored, deployed, maintained.

  30. rick gregory

    it’s interesting to see all the comments. A few thoughts from Seattle…1) The question is why Amazon wants a 2nd HQ. They’re finished a major build out here so they’re not likely to leave anytime soon. Before projecting or arguing for any particular city to land the new offices we need to ask… why not simply expand in Seattle?No inside baseball but I can see the reasoning being both cost of living skyrocketing and our transportation infrastructure sucking, making commutes of any distance hellish (we have no light rail to speak of yet so commutes are by car… i.e. they’re not just long but you can’t simply zone out and read a book etc). Seattle is also pretty compact and with 2 bodies of water on either side (East and West) there’s limited expansion.2) Another reason might be the immigration cluster… er issue. Amazon wouldn’t want to be unable to hire the best talent because of this. Now, this could be a short term issue and not a major driver but if it’s on the radar and is even close to being a main reason then no US city will be on the list. Think Vancouver or Toronto then.3) If the new HQ is intended to hold 50,000 people and they’re not moving Seattle (which they aren’t, quite apparently), then you have to be in a location that can supply or attract a lot of HQ style talent – engineers, product people, etc. They don’t all have to be there already but the area needs to be someplace where people who CAN live in Boulder, SF, NYC, Austin etc will want to live. For that reason, I can’t see places like Portland, Maine, Delaware, etc. In general such people want a pretty urban environment with a lot to do.4) Be aware of the impact this will have on your city – housing prices in most places will skyrocket which will put pressure on people whose taxes go up (remember prop 13?). Traffic will see a significant impact. You’ll have tension between very well off newcomers and current residents. Most of this wouldn’t affect, say, Brooklyn. But a smaller city? Yes, there are a lot of positives – but you’ll need to prep for the side-effects too.

  31. Pete Griffiths

    It’s also seriously expensive.

  32. sigmaalgebra

    We might notice that Trump’s US speech with… we will have no choice but to totally destroy North Korea.could also alert both China and Russia, both of whom share a border with Dumb Dung Dong Rocket Boy’s Ping Pong Song Ding Yang slave colony and, thus, might get some unwanted effects and, thus, might want to take seriously working with the US and the UN to put Rocket Boy on the new, super fast, North Asia weight loss diet that will get him to shut up, sit down, listen up, and obey his superiors. The alternative is the US “Mad Dog” Mattis super high speed crash diet where Rocket Boy would lose 250 pounds of ugly fat in less than 1 millisecond.Uh, I suspect that Trump is determined not to leave the White House leaving his grandchildren, children, family, country, and world to the threats of North Korean, Persian, etc. nuke wackos.Else Trump could give the world beautiful, new, perfectly round, glass lined, glowing in the dark, hemispherical bottom, blue waters of Lake Ping Pong Song Ding Yang and Lake Tehran.

  33. Ana Milicevic

    I agree w/ all of the pros you’ve listed and would perhaps selfishly want them here, too. But I don’t for one simple reason: we’re shifting from centralized systems to distributive ones and our physical spaces (eg. cities) need to reflect this too. Amazon has the potential to be a beacon driver of commercial activity in a smaller city; we have many of those beacons in NYC already across many industries (part of what makes us so unique). Amazon should go build in another city and look up to the German model of strong, well-connected adjacent cities, each with their own economic and cultural flavor.

  34. Thomas Luk

    Great initiative!

  35. Rick Mason

    Don’t discount Amazon choosing Detroit.1. Dan Gilbert is leading the charge and he’s proven time and time again he can accomplish what others say is impossible2. Windsor across the river in Canada is joining the bid and as long as one campus building is in Windsor then the bid would qualify for economic development checks from both Michigan and Canada3. Jeff Bezos would be in the same position of influence as Henry Ford was in 1920 in Detroit. In New York City he’d be one of many power figures in the city4. Choice of real estate – on the river, multiple locations downtown or midtown or maybe even take over the old city airport. No other city can offer so many choices to fit whatever criteria Amazon puts forward5. Three universities worth of engineers, University of Michigan, Michigan State and Wayne State.6. Amazon already has an engineering headquarters in downtown Detroit plus two warehouses in the metro area and they’re building a third.7. Did I mention that Dan Gilbert and Jeff Bezos vacation together?It may come as a shock to the New York Times when Detroit are chosen but they’ve been wrong before ;<).

  36. Jay Janney

    As cities develop their bids on this, allow be to be a bit of a wet towell and remind them to review the academic literature on “The Winner’s Curse”…..Amazon coming to town sounds great…unless they ever struggle….or have massive layoffs….or become major league uncool…..Or demogrpahics shift and people decide they like shopping as entertainment….etc.As a community, I’d be wary of having that large of an employer in town…

  37. ShanaC

    Amazon already has an office in NYC though

  38. Chris Phenner

    Greetings from Chicago.We have 100 acres available and a $10bn, 10-year plan, released a week ago. Sears Roebuck was a startup, Montgomery Ward an awkward 2.0, and we’re now ready.https://chicago.curbed.com/

  39. Himanshu

    Amazon will still not come to NYC because there are more possibilities in Austin and Texas. There is lot for them in TX too. NYC is a great alternative though.

  40. jortpossel

    The limited view of NYC living here is probably a tourist thing. There is no richer, more diverse and international city in the US than NYC. Not even close.Which makes me emphasize #1. It’s not just the talent base, building stock and transportation system. It’s being plugged into the world, being able to think global. If Amazon wants to conquer the world, from where will they do that. Austin? Denver? Don’t think so. #NYTech

  41. CLM

    Amazon is already in NYC. Several departments work out of the building they lease on 34th street and they are expanding to other buildings and areas of the city as well. Amazon has had a quiet presence here for years.

  42. Damian

    How about New Jersey? Probably cheaper and as close to important hubs/transporation routes?

  43. JLM

    .Chicago 500 2017 YTD murders. Yeah, Chicago looks like a win.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  44. JamesHRH

    Is Denver far enough east? It does seem to have everything else going for it.So many major centres get cut due to transit: ATL, NYC, TOR, Houston……

  45. kidmercury

    chicago can’t afford the corporate welfare that will be needed to seduce amazon.

  46. PhilipSugar

    The very, very dark horse is Wilmington. I think they are going to want an East Coast 2ndHQ and the logical would be Fairfax or NYC.Now if you are right and only 10% will be tech? Then there is a chance, there are a tremendous number of their distribution centers here. 4 within 15 miles of each other.I would not count out Austin though. See my comment to JLM.

  47. JamesHRH

    I am a HUGE NYC fan.But, no politician is the reason it is the greatest city in the world. The massive egos and desire to ‘Make It’ in finance, real estate, fashion and show biz is the source of its greatness.NYC is humanity writ large, with frailties and greatness side by side (a lot of that here in Houston & TX, FWIW).Not a De Blasio fan, right from the point that he used his biracial 16 year old son in campaign ads, to play up his progressive street crew (very Trump like) through to his recent comment that the biggest hurdle he faces in attacking income inequality is property rights (Wha? – very Hugo Chavez like).

  48. bogorad

    NYC is absolutely the greatest city in the world, no argument there. However, by no means does it owe its greatness to the current populist/socialist crowd.

  49. TeddyBeingTeddy

    Is it the smell of trash along the sidewalks all summer, the absence of a beach, the constant congestion/noise/construction, the pushy people, absurd prices, or something else that makes you love NYC?

  50. JLM

    .True dat. In the last year, I have met more than a dozen ex-Chicago tech transplants. Most are tax refugees, not shooters.We let the honest folk have guns in Texas.Probably most are weather related. We have an ongoing shortage of snow.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  51. Pointsandfigures

    They are tax transplants. I don’t know a lot of Chicago people moving to Austin, which is a nice place. I do know they are moving to Indiana, Nashville, Dallas, Atlanta and Florida.

  52. TeddyBeingTeddy

    Not true. The migration is the people that lived in the projects in the West side of Chicago (cabrini green etc.) that got leveled. They all went to Atlanta. the reason crime is up in the gang area is because they’re fighting over less and less territory. Getting squeezed out, and can’t afford to go anywhere except Atlanta and Naperville.

  53. JLM

    .I don’t think Denver or Colorado have the educational infrastructure.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  54. ShanaC

    yes, and Denver international airport is the major transport hub except for vegas to all of the US – but vegas also doesn’t do as much commercial traffic as Denver.

  55. Pointsandfigures

    Yes, but lets be real. That’s in a few neighborhoods nowhere near where anyone from Amazon will go. The murders are a problem but Chicago isn’t the only city with that problem. Gang wars and drug wars are nationwide, as Milton Friedman predicted.

  56. TeddyBeingTeddy

    True but that’s isolated to two small areas that never bleeds into anywhere remotely close where these people would live work. The murders are as distant to people in Chicago as they are to you. Also, it’s now at 502 since you posted this message.

  57. Pointsandfigures

    Pittsburgh has a good tech sector. You are right about the airport. In the old days it was larger. It is a huge pain in the butt to have to fly to another airport before you actually “fly”. That’s Austin, New Orleans and other small cities. Dallas, Houston, Miami, and Atlanta are the hubs of the South. Chicago has Cinespace. Cutting edge soundstages which are basically unused. Amazon could use them as a media company. They are right next to Lagunitas brewery.

  58. PhilipSugar

    If you want a top hub airport then PHL has a chance 8 non-stops to London a day.

  59. TeddyBeingTeddy

    I think Denver is too close to current HQ. They want regional diversification. Chicago or Austin clearly makes the most sense I think. Boston has great engineering talent, but logistics and COLA will make it less convincing than Chicago and Austin. Look at all the companies moving into Chicago, city is making all the right incentives and has all the talent. Austin and Chicago are the finalists for sure. Both great cities, curious to see who wins.

  60. Susan Rubinsky

    Pittsburgh has talent. And also the largest, most renowned robotics R&D center in the United States at Carnegie Mellon. It also has reasonable housing costs compared to many other areas.

  61. JamesHRH

    A Great Plains talent collector city.Calgary was the same way; get that vibe a bit here in the H ( although the H draws talent from everywhere ).

  62. JLM

    .Huh? “CO higher-level education ain’t no slouch …”Where did that come from?The best school in the state is the Colorado School of Mines. The rest of them — U of C (Boulder, Denver, CSprings), Colorado State — are border line diploma mills.To give you a concrete bit of data — C School of Mines admits about 38% of applicants while Colorado and State accept 80-92%.The most elite college in the state is Colorado College in Colorado Springs which accepts only 17% of applicants.To put that into perspective Harvard accepts about 5.4% and Princeton 6.5% of applicants.Hard to square that statement about Colorado higher ed with the facts?https://www.niche.com/colle…I like fact based discussions.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  63. Jeff Judge

    Isn’t water an issue in Austin long term?

  64. TeddyBeingTeddy

    GE and ESPN both tried the remote east coast suburb. Both made a mistake. Amazon won’t do the same. It’ll go to a vibrant city full of life and talent where young people want to live, at a reasonable cost of living.

  65. LE

    SJ is making a bid as well. Cheap housing (like dirt cheap) and good access to Philly. 20 minutes to PHL or less. High property taxes but my guess is that that can be worked around in some way. Good access to the rest of the east coast.Philly has Philly wage tax. Locating in SJ makes it easy for millenials to live in cc Philly. Close to NYC and DC.

  66. ShanaC

    but not so many to other parts of the US

  67. PhilipSugar

    No, we had a person shot in the eye in a very affluent neighborhood. he only survived because somehow (he doesn’t remember) he cocked his head. Lost his eye. Over a damn wallet. He would have given it willingly.

  68. JLM

    .Jeffrey, I love you like a brother. Imagine this convo.Girl gets a job at Azon in Chicago.”Mom, I got a job, a real job.””Where, darling? I’m so excited. Where?””Chicago, Mom.””Dear, there were a thousand murders in Chicago and four thousand wounded with guns last year. Are you sure?””Don’t worry, Mom. They’re isolated to two neighborhoods.””Well, dear, I didn’t know that. Good luck. And, darling?””Yes, Mom, what?””Get a fucking concealed handgun permit and shoot first.””Mom, I can’t get a gun permit in Chicago.””So why the fuck are you taking this job again, darling?”Plus, there’s the freakin’ weather.No, Chicago is a free fire zone and only the bad guys have guns.JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  69. awaldstein

    and LA

  70. JamesHRH

    Since moving the The H, my wife has been to Nashville a bit and loves it. New Orleans, but clean and safe.

  71. JLM

    .Back in the Sam Rayburn – LBJ days, Austin made a bet on impoundment. There is a series of dammed impoundments going back into the Hill Country.They are built along the watercourse of the Colorado River. The lakes are enormous from Buchanan to Inks to LBJ to Marble Falls to Travis to Town Lake. Huge lakes with waves and stuff.It is all managed by something called the Lower Colorado River Authority which is HQed in Austin.San Antonio decided to go with drilled water wells which means they are betting on the ground water getting into an aquifer and staying there.Austin is fine. San Antone has some limitations.Austin still has the ability to drill, baby, drill — for water.In addition, we have margaritas. You go to Matt’s El Rancho or Guero’s and tell them you want a margarita. By the second one (the truth serum margarita) you’re saying, “I will never drink water again when there is tequila in the house.”What we have a problem with is too many people moving here. Especially those Californians. Just kidding, y’all come, hear?JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  72. JamesHRH


  73. JamesHRH

    From Chicago?

  74. JamesHRH

    I can vouch for the Margarita Affect.Always liked one when we were out and about in hot weather. We basically drink ’em 4 nights a week now.

  75. JamesHRH

    Good point.

  76. ShanaC

    they have a small distribution center in the state and in NYC, because they sell Amazon Fresh in NYC, along with that one hour prime thing. My ex-neighbors were addicted to Amazon Fresh and the 1 hour prime thing when they first had their second kid.

  77. JLM

    .The Original — Ninfa’s on Navigation — where the concept of the “designated driver” was born.Been there yet?JLMwww.themusingsofthebigredca…

  78. PhilipSugar

    Have you every been to Delaware? Serious question.

  79. SFG

    You forgot the smell of urine!

  80. JamesHRH

    No, but it is near the top of a really long list – very impressed by depth & breadth of restaurants here .Again, The H is way underrated on that score too.

  81. Susan Rubinsky

    I think Philly will be a a good contender.

  82. Susan Rubinsky

    I just visited Nashville this past Spring. My take on it? Disney’s version of Music land. I have no desire to ever go back. Very homogenized.

  83. TeddyBeingTeddy

    No. Fortunately none of my companies have had to file BK so I’ve never been to DE or their courts. It’s definitely business friendly and i hear very pretty. i would like to visit so long as its not for court.

  84. ShanaC

    who do you think is feeding all of those aerospace military companies out in CO?Colorado School of Mines is a top 100 engineering school – CU-Boulder’s head of the CS department specializes in AI research.Plus there has been a huge influx from CA tech people in the past 5 years to Boulder-Denver metro.I literally just moved to CO, and the scariest thing about this place is how few people share my fiance’s accent – he was born in CO!

  85. PhilipSugar

    ???? PHL had more than 394k flights last year and had 30mm passengers.There is no place in the U.S. you can’t get a direct less than twice a day. I know I am an American 3mm miler. Places like SEA? 4 a day. You like early morning noon or night? Your choice.I had people in from London today. Which is why I said that.

  86. ShanaC

    Denver is the 6th busiest airport in the countryhttps://www.flydenver.com/a…

  87. PhilipSugar

    Can you pilot a plane or have flown 3mm miles? I have. It is different.